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	<title>Comments on: Lavi Redux</title>
	<atom:link href="http://israeloutlook.com/2007/10/26/lavi-redux/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://israeloutlook.com/2007/10/26/lavi-redux/</link>
	<description>An unflinching view from a place called Israel</description>
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	<item>
		<title>By: wesley</title>
		<link>http://israeloutlook.com/2007/10/26/lavi-redux/comment-page-1/#comment-10260</link>
		<dc:creator>wesley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Nov 2007 23:26:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://israeloutlook.com/2007/10/26/lavi-redux/#comment-10260</guid>
		<description>I guess I&#039;m still not clear as to why there is so much attention being focused on this possible (although not yet confirmed) Chinese sale.

There was a fairly comprehensive summary published last year, in the British magazine Combat Aircraft (Vol 7 No&#039;s 8 &amp; 9), covering the ongoing modernization of China&#039;s air force - including Israel&#039;s involvement in the J-10:
http://www.ianallanpublishing.com/product.php?productid=49503&amp;cat=1037&amp;page=1
http://www.ianallanpublishing.com/product.php?productid=51326&amp;cat=1037&amp;page=1

To put it in simple terms:

- Yes, Israel did supply military technology to China during the 1990s - including assistance in the development of the J-10 fighter

- Yes, the J-10 did draw on Israel&#039;s Lavi experience

- NO, the J-10 is NOT a copy of the Lavi.  The J-10 is a much larger airplane than the Lavi was intended to be, built around the limited selection of Russian jet engines available to China, and the more limited manufacturing capabilities that China could afford.

- Yes, the US government was well aware of Israeli participation in Chinese weapons programs during the 1990s - and accepted Israel&#039;s role, as well as that of various European arms deals with China.

- When the US government changed its view on China&#039;s potential threat, following a series of espionage scandals in the late 1990s, Israel halted all further cooperation with China on the J-10 or other projects.

- Without the sensor suite and properly trained pilots to accompany it, the utility of the J-10 in Iranian hands would be highly limited.

Quite frankly, the Clinton Administration was as much to blame for Israeli involvement on the J-10 as were the Israeli contractors who provided their consulting expertise.  If the US had objected early-on - rather than years later - the entire J-10 program might never have left the drawing board.

- wesley</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I guess I&#8217;m still not clear as to why there is so much attention being focused on this possible (although not yet confirmed) Chinese sale.</p>
<p>There was a fairly comprehensive summary published last year, in the British magazine Combat Aircraft (Vol 7 No&#8217;s 8 &amp; 9), covering the ongoing modernization of China&#8217;s air force &#8211; including Israel&#8217;s involvement in the J-10:<br />
<a href="http://www.ianallanpublishing.com/product.php?productid=49503&#038;cat=1037&#038;page=1" rel="nofollow">http://www.ianallanpublishing.com/product.php?productid=49503&#038;cat=1037&#038;page=1</a><br />
<a href="http://www.ianallanpublishing.com/product.php?productid=51326&#038;cat=1037&#038;page=1" rel="nofollow">http://www.ianallanpublishing.com/product.php?productid=51326&#038;cat=1037&#038;page=1</a></p>
<p>To put it in simple terms:</p>
<p>- Yes, Israel did supply military technology to China during the 1990s &#8211; including assistance in the development of the J-10 fighter</p>
<p>- Yes, the J-10 did draw on Israel&#8217;s Lavi experience</p>
<p>- NO, the J-10 is NOT a copy of the Lavi.  The J-10 is a much larger airplane than the Lavi was intended to be, built around the limited selection of Russian jet engines available to China, and the more limited manufacturing capabilities that China could afford.</p>
<p>- Yes, the US government was well aware of Israeli participation in Chinese weapons programs during the 1990s &#8211; and accepted Israel&#8217;s role, as well as that of various European arms deals with China.</p>
<p>- When the US government changed its view on China&#8217;s potential threat, following a series of espionage scandals in the late 1990s, Israel halted all further cooperation with China on the J-10 or other projects.</p>
<p>- Without the sensor suite and properly trained pilots to accompany it, the utility of the J-10 in Iranian hands would be highly limited.</p>
<p>Quite frankly, the Clinton Administration was as much to blame for Israeli involvement on the J-10 as were the Israeli contractors who provided their consulting expertise.  If the US had objected early-on &#8211; rather than years later &#8211; the entire J-10 program might never have left the drawing board.</p>
<p>- wesley</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: tedders</title>
		<link>http://israeloutlook.com/2007/10/26/lavi-redux/comment-page-1/#comment-9796</link>
		<dc:creator>tedders</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Oct 2007 04:25:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://israeloutlook.com/2007/10/26/lavi-redux/#comment-9796</guid>
		<description>http://web.israelinsider.com/Articles/Security/12277.htm</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://web.israelinsider.com/Articles/Security/12277.htm" rel="nofollow">http://web.israelinsider.com/Articles/Security/12277.htm</a></p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Anna</title>
		<link>http://israeloutlook.com/2007/10/26/lavi-redux/comment-page-1/#comment-9687</link>
		<dc:creator>Anna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Oct 2007 23:20:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://israeloutlook.com/2007/10/26/lavi-redux/#comment-9687</guid>
		<description>Cool statement, SP:)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Cool statement, SP:)</p>
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		<title>By: John Little</title>
		<link>http://israeloutlook.com/2007/10/26/lavi-redux/comment-page-1/#comment-9573</link>
		<dc:creator>John Little</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Oct 2007 01:42:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://israeloutlook.com/2007/10/26/lavi-redux/#comment-9573</guid>
		<description>Hey Tedders,

Looks can be deceiving, but it certainly is true that the J-10 can&#039;t outperform the JSF or even the F-22.

It doesn&#039;t need to.

It just needs to outperform the F-16 and F/A-18, which it does. 

It just needs to be able to deliver nuclear weapons on target, which it can.

Furthermore, it serves as an excellent example of corruption at work. 

General Dynamics and Lockheed Martin killed the Lavi and gave birth to a whole new industry in China.

This kind of corruption at Israel&#039;s expense is just more-of-the-same, and it makes me sick.

   - John

PS. Oh, and the data that we have on the J-10 is OLD. China has had the J-10 for quite a few years and has been hard at work on advanced variants and new generations.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Tedders,</p>
<p>Looks can be deceiving, but it certainly is true that the J-10 can&#8217;t outperform the JSF or even the F-22.</p>
<p>It doesn&#8217;t need to.</p>
<p>It just needs to outperform the F-16 and F/A-18, which it does. </p>
<p>It just needs to be able to deliver nuclear weapons on target, which it can.</p>
<p>Furthermore, it serves as an excellent example of corruption at work. </p>
<p>General Dynamics and Lockheed Martin killed the Lavi and gave birth to a whole new industry in China.</p>
<p>This kind of corruption at Israel&#8217;s expense is just more-of-the-same, and it makes me sick.</p>
<p>   &#8211; John</p>
<p>PS. Oh, and the data that we have on the J-10 is OLD. China has had the J-10 for quite a few years and has been hard at work on advanced variants and new generations.</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: John Little</title>
		<link>http://israeloutlook.com/2007/10/26/lavi-redux/comment-page-1/#comment-9562</link>
		<dc:creator>John Little</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Oct 2007 01:30:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://israeloutlook.com/2007/10/26/lavi-redux/#comment-9562</guid>
		<description>Hey Barb,

Of course you can, and you have my thanks.

  - John</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Barb,</p>
<p>Of course you can, and you have my thanks.</p>
<p>  &#8211; John</p>
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